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but i just don't get it, why do you guys keep saying that the supernatural/human parallels didn't have a resolution? they had one, I think it all was foreshadowing the crypt scene in 8.17, but of course without the romantic element. They just put romantic couples instead of friendship ones as parallels because romance is clearly more powerful and people love love stories. Or maybe they weren't even parallels to Destiel, just random, unintentional romantic couples. And besides, why make (1)
spn beings/human couples as parallels/foreshadowing when TPTB knew Cas was gonna become human? it just doesn’t make sense. And also, there weren’t many parallels anyway, 9 you said? well, of all them, I’m sure only 3-4 were actual intentional parallels, and they were all IMO foreshadowing the crypt scene in 8.17. But I digress. All I’m saying is thatthese parallels were either 1. paralleling friendship Destiel (in 8.17, aka already resolved), 2. because TPTB like to write love stories, 3. unintentional/not foreshadowing/not parallels, 4. Megstiel, Sam/Dean or Dean/Benny parallels, or paralleling a possible supernatual being love interest for Dean or Sam in s9, 5. just queerbaiting/fanservice to make shippers believe Destiel would go canon when it won’t, 6. Destiel intention but network interference/change of mind, 7. Bad writing.
Great point, anon, and I certainly agree up to a point. I do think that quite a few creature/human parallels were meant to be for the crypt scene, much in the same way that I think 8x06 was meant to be a parallel to the crypt scene. Charlie and Gilda are a clear example of a direct parallel to the crypt scene, with Dean “breaking the spell” on Cas and helping free him of Naomi’s control.
But I also think that a lot of the parallels are supposed to parallel the relationship Dean and Cas already have. For example, I think Benny and Andrea was a direct parallel to Cas in Season 4 and 5, where he denounces his creator and turns to Dean, and “sees something in humanity”. It’s possible that Cas didn’t do it out of romantic love, but there was definitely something incredibly strong there- why else would he have rebelled and put himself on Heaven’s crapper list?
Other parallels (Portia and James stick out here, as well as Prometheus and Hayley and everything surrounding that) are meant to give insight on what “could be”; this is the potential outcome that may occur between Dean/Cas if given the right circumstances. There was a potential “happy ending”; there was a potential “sacrifice yourself”. These were all “potentials” on what could happen, much like 8x06 in my above meta was a potential “what could have been” for the crypt scene.
So while yeah, I think the parallels are still “open” (I don’t think they entirely are, but people see them as “empty” or “unfulfilled” because Destiel didn’t happen), I also see them as partially closed. I think the open part is leading us to the “same-sex” couple stuff, where it kind of transitioned with Charlie’s storyline, then there was Aaron, and now the two men at the bar. Just like Season 7 transitioned into these supernatural/human pairings, I’m wondering if we may be seeing more same-sex pairings in Season 9 as well.
I do want to say that I don’t think this can easily be chalked up to bad writing, queerbaiting, or the network backing out. I do think it could be paralleling Sam/Amelia, Meg, as well as non-romantic Dean/Cas. I don’t think it is unintentional;, but they could be seen as that and the writers just liking love stories. There are many MANY ways to read those parallels; my way is not law and I don’t ask people to agree with it entirely. ;) But I definitely see what you are saying, and I certainly agree to an extent. It will all make for a very interesting Season 9, indeed!
Sure, ask away! The easy answer to this is simply that I think Dean is bi, because I don’t think his interest in women was ever a fake or forced thing. I think he has become disinterested in women as sexual partners or romantic interests however, and has shown for a long time a decreasing want to be with them (to the point where he is outright denying them, even though he was initially flirtatious).
Dean is a funny guy. And there is meta upon meta better than mine about his potential sexual orientation(this one is my personal favorite). But to call him 100% gay would be really incongruous with who he is, just like calling him 100% straight would also be incongruous.
I consider Castiel a potential love interest (esp. in canon) because if Dean gets over his issues with his identity and sexuality (which he has made great leaps this season towards accepting), he may see that Castiel really is there for him, and is the best he’s gonna get (and when it’s an angel of the Lord, fallen or not, that’s pretty good, imo). He’s the closest friend Dean has, and now that he’s human, he’ll be with the boys a lot more, showing that 1) he can’t just keep running away from them and 2) they can work through the issues and feelings that have been stewing between him and Dean for the last 2-3 years (in the show). At this point in the show, there’s no reason to engage Dean in a new female romantic interest, not when all of Season 8 and a good chunk of Season 7 was devoted to explicitly showing us how much Dean is just NOT into women that way anymore. Does he enjoy them? Sure he does! He flirts openly and likes to be playful with female figures, but he has shown time and time again the he’s not looking to “tap that” and have even close to a one-night stand. But it is clear that, decreased libido from PTSD or not(I can’t currently find the meta I’m thinking of for this), he’s still a sexual creature, and he still enjoys the idea of something physical, something real. It’s just that his attention is shifting and he’s trying to figure out why.
He states he wants to be but can’t with Ellie in Trial and Error. He stutters and stops around the idea of potentially hanging with Aaron. He shifts his entire body at the image of a cleaned-up Cas. Not to mention how many times he’s looked Cas up and down, and when he’s happy with Cas at the beginning of the season, he’s hardly more than a foot away from him. And not even mentioning romantic/sexual relationships, Dean has been hugging everyone like crazy this season; at least 3 times more than all the other seasons combined.
Dean is physical. He wants that connection with someone. And it’s obvious that he’s only sharing any kind of physical connection with the people he already knows and loves. So of course he’ll soon want to be closer with Cas, now that he’s around. I wouldn’t be surprised if now that Cas is going to essentially be living with the boys at the bunker (because where else will he go) we’re going to be seeing more “peach fuzz” moments, aka more touching, poking, nudging, grabbing, little-to-no-personal-space, stuck-like-glue moments. Now that Dean is going to have Cas in a position where Cas can’t really leave, do you really think Dean is going to let that go? We saw how upset he was at the end of the season with Cas’s constant back-and-forth. He was so angry that he didn’t talk to him for a whole episode, prompting Cas to go out and try to shop for all of Dean’s favorite things to make up for it. So do I think Dean and Cas are going to be closer next season? Oh yeah. A lot, lot, lot closer.
And since Cas is already so close to Dean, and Dean clearly has a physical need to be close to those he cares about, and they have mutual interests that they can talk about and share, plus all the emotional and spiritual intimacy that comes with saving each other’s asses from Hell/Purgatory/Apocalypse/etc., there’s a perfect brew for them to finally sit down and really express how they feel and move forward with their relationship. But it’s only going to happen if they can sit down and talk it out. They need some moments to themselves where they can really be frank with each other. It’s something that Dean and Cas both need; up until this point, all season, they have been constantly interrupted and halted from their more emotional and heart-felt comments. They need to spend some time in the bunker, just the two of them, and talk it out.
And I think we’ll see that somewhere mid next season, perhaps, if not sooner or later, depending on what the writers have in mind. But whatever it is, it should be realistically resolved in a timely manner. I’m expecting some tension, which will ease (like it always does between them),they’ll talk things out, and Dean will do the “touchy feely” things, small things that Cas might not have noticed before but now that he’s human, he does notice them, which may or may not gradually escalate from there. The biggest issue of course with Dean and Cas’s relationship is that it has to feel organic from the prospect of the casual viewer, so just like everything else, it’s baby steps. But if the same-sex romance parallels get more frequent this next season, well, I think we all know where they will be going from there. ;)
Hello! First off, since I haven't said this yet, your trueform Cas was absolutely gorgeous! <3 Also, I had a question about the finale. In Clip Show, Dean had some major trust issues with Cas, but they seemed completely gone in the finale. I took it as Dean having accepted that Cas doesn't trust him and doesn't want to stay with him (hence the bittersweet "ET goes home" comment). Not sure if I'm just making excuses for the writers though, so I just wanted to hear your thoughts on this. Thanks!
Hmmm, I don’t really think his bitterness left entirely when Cas first showed up, actually but I DO think it dissipated over the course of the episode. There’s this thing with Dean where he can never really “stay” mad at Castiel; no matter what Cas has done, he’s always found a way to forgive him in an unspoken manner.
Now! Back to the question: When Cas first shows up, remember that Dean hasn’t seen him for oh, about a day I’d say. He left, Dean was annoyed, and as soon as Cas shows up, saying he needs Dean’s help, he jumps a little and angrily tells him “Little busy Cas, take a number”, basically brushing him off completely. He doesn’t want Cas there, not when he has Crowley tied up and about to blow. He’s very reluctant and I don’t think he trusted Cas fully, but he never really lost complete trust in Cas; he was just upset and angry that he left in Clip Show; he was being emotional about Cas not being there. He doesn’t leave with Cas until after Sam insists anyway. Once Sam says it’s okay though, he takes that as enough of a reason and leaves with Cas.
And he helps Cas. He tries to help him see reason. Don’t attack the Cupid, “Talk first, stab later okay?”. Don’t just outright attack Naomi, Dean tells him. Dean knew something was off when Kevin was on the other line who had never lied to him before and Castiel who is getting fed information from an angel he doesn’t know or trust. But he knew it wasn’t Castiel that he didn’t trust; it was who was on the other end: Metatron. And when Naomi appeared crying and confirmed this, it was Dean’s worst fear- that Cas had been tricked and it was all gonna end badly. No matter what, Dean didn’t stop caring about Cas, making sure he made the right move, making sure he was okay.But he also knew that Cas was feeling resolute in this. He needed to let Cas go; to do what Cas needed to do. And that bittersweet “ET goes home” line is Dean knowing that well, maybe Cas won’t come back after this one. Maybe he’ll be gone for good. And instead, I think Cas knew he was coming back all along, but never had the chance to say it.
That’s also why I think the first thing Dean said when he saw those angels falling (because he knew right away, I do not doubt) he said “No, Cas!” because he knew something terrible had happened; this wasn’t what Cas wanted, nobody wanted this. They were supposed to get the angels back INTO Heaven, not expelled. I also think it’s incredibly poignant that Dean screamed out the name “Castiel”, not just Cas. He hardly ever calls Cas, “Castiel”; he wasn’t just calling for his brother but for him too. He needed to know Cas was alright because who knew what would have happened to him at that point.
So no, I think the writers knew exactly what they were doing and were in-tune with Dean’s feelings. It wasn’t that Dean had trust issues with Cas in 8.22, it was that he was hurting because Cas kept leaving, and Dean couldn’t take it anymore. The viewers can’t even take it anymore! So of course he had issues with that; but that wasn’t the point. Cas also DID come back to Dean in 8.23, and that was significant. Especially because Cas never says WHY he needs Dean; it’s almost like he just needed Dean to come along so he could have back-up, so he wouldn’t be alone or wouldn’t make a dumb move. He never needed Dean to do and talking (“It seems that this will involve… talking to people”), he didn’t need Dean to fight anything for him (“No killing this time”), he just Needed Dean. For no other reason than to have Dean come along. To be there. And I think that says a lot, and I think Dean understood that. And that’s why he went with Cas (with Sam’s blessing of course).
Because damn if they don’t need each other.
Wow I picked up a lot of new followers since last night. It’s always so nice to see new faces.
Hi guys how’s it going. I’m Lauren, I write meta and I draw trueforms. I think ya’ll are fantastic no matter what I promise. If you ever wanna chat I’m as open as a trenchcoat on a stripper.
I’m gonna go back to painting falling angels and disintegrating wings, so stay tuned to more art soon. :]
It’s gonna be an awesome summer~~~
/post/50581759627/whats-with-all-those-empty-parallels-a-season-8 This so much! Because of everything, I don't have much hope they will actually end up together, but because of what you said and fallen Castiel, I say there is at least a bit of hope. Especially since he's fallen, because like I always thought, and Misha himself said that, being in a romantic relationship with an angel? Would not be easy.
You’re right; it wouldn’t be easy at all! I also want to point out this lovely remark made by Jensen as well. While everything going on was nothing short of ridiculous, Jensen was still able to make a serious point that actually holds some interesting back light. Especially in the second-to-last panel, he states:
“It’s a “supernatural” relationship, not really having any humanistic feelings of- [panda drops] …I’m so sorry”.
But even then, the entire response was talking about how because Cas was an angel, he could not understand how important he is to Dean, because he doesn’t feel those emotions as deeply. And it’s an interesting thing to say, because well, Jensen and Misha both knew, at that time, that Castiel was no longer an angel; he had his Grace taken and he had fallen. So to say the reason that Castiel didn’t understand Dean was the human/angel divide is very interesting. I almost feel as if they are saying underneath that “well Castiel ISN’T an angel now, so we’ll see how things play out from there.”
Next season is something I am definitely looking forward to. I am expecting awesome things, and a whole slew of new ideas on how to deal with this new problem and predicament of fallen angels and an “evil” Metatron.
apparently - and I say this because I, too, hadn’t fully understood that - he actually meant THREE YEAR PLAN
yes, the C plot was left hanging
there was no resolution of it in the end
because it WASN’T the end
many elements of the season didn’t have closure
because they WERE NOT SUPPOSED to come to full circle within the season
as I get it now, this was PART ONE OF THREE of a super-season
this has been a PSA
Basically the way I understand it is that with a three year plan he’s going to loosely follow the 3 Act Structure. For those unfamiliar the 3 Act Structure is a very common way to plot out a movie or novel.
This graph will help you visualize the linear plot line.
Each season follows a 3 Act Structure. Even individual episodes follow this same structure.
The first act is usually used for exposition, to establish the main characters, their relationships and the world they live in. Later in the first act, a dynamic, on-screen incident occurs that confronts the main character (the protagonist), whose attempts to deal with this incident lead to a second and more dramatic situation, known as the first turning point, which (a) signals the end of the first act, (b) ensures life will never be the same again for the protagonist and (c) raises a dramatic question that will be answered in the climax of the film. The dramatic question should be framed in terms of the protagonist’s call to action, (Will X recover the diamond? Will Y get the girl? Will Z capture the killer?). This is known as the inciting incident, or catalyst. As an example, the inciting incident in the 1972 film The Godfather is when Vito Corleone is shot, which occurs approximately 40 minutes into the film.
The second act, also referred to as “rising action”, typically depicts the protagonist’s attempt to resolve the problem initiated by the first turning point, only to find his- or herself in ever worsening situations. Part of the reason protagonists seem unable to resolve their problems is because they do not yet have the skills to deal with the forces of antagonismthat confront them. They must not only learn new skills but arrive at a higher sense of awareness of who they are and what they are capable of, in order to deal with their predicament, which in turn changes who they are. This is referred to as character development. This cannot be achieved alone and they are usually aided and abetted by mentors and co-protagonists.
The third act features the resolution of the story and its subplots. The climax, also known as the second turning point, is the scene or sequence in which the main tensions of the story are brought to their most intense point and the dramatic question answered, leaving the protagonist and other characters with a new sense of who they really are. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three-act_structure).
According to this description last night’s episode closed the first act on this particular storyline. The Goal, Motivation, and Conflict have been established. The Goal is most likely to find out how to shut Heaven, help Sam recover and . The motivation for Dean is family and wanting to protect them. The Conflict is the fact that now they have not only demons to contend with but pissy stranded angels.
We as viewers now understand what is important to Dean, why it is urgent and what potential obstacles lie ahead.
The characters, Dean, Sam and Cas, have reached a point of no return. There is no going back to how life was last week. And this sets us up for Act 2 where more characterization happens along with attempts to resolve the problem that fail and ever worsening situations. Sounds like a lot to look forward to come 9.01.
Could you explain to me why you see the scene as “using himself as bait”? It seemed to me like Cas was just reading off things from the personal ads to see what the dude would prefer and not understanding the implications it would have.
“Using himself as bait” as in, I’m going to talk to this guy and see if I can get anything out of him that might indicate his “type”, or what he likes in bed, etc. It may have just been a silly thing of “oh Cas, not knowing proper human etiquette” however to me, and to the bartender, it sounded like Cas was hitting on him, saying something similar to “are you into light BDSM” and the man’s answer is “dude IT’S A TUESDAY AT 10 AM” meaning “do I look like I’m in the mood to you?” There’s really no other way to interpret that guy’s response except as “he thought Cas was hitting on him and he’s telling him he isn’t biting”.
It’s also interesting to note that the man doesn’t outright turn down Cas; he basically tells him “It’s way too early in the morning for that, buddy” which was nice of him, at the very least.
*remember this is all my own interpretation and speculation ofc*
Sarasarai: I counted all of them. I would believe there are probably 9 cross-species ones though I don’t have a count of those.
Thanks for the fast reply! I figured you had, and I knew I was leaving out plenty of romances because they weren’t specific human/monster ones, haha. Sam/Amelia is a big one for example that I didn’t mention. They are a meta in and of themselves.
/crosses fingers for a Amelia return in Season 9. *w*
Cas totaly hit on the bartender; it's blatantly portrayed that way, and at first I was confused nd figured maybe Cas missed the human customs re. orientation-related issues, but then it turned out Cas's gaydar is much better than mine. =) I'm still confused though by him saying he's 'frineds with friends who do this all the time'...
I’m honestly betting it was Balthazar. He was someone who knew his way around when it came to getting the ladies. And we all know how Sebastian is. ;)
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